Episode 219 - Discussion of 'Outlander' Episode 305 - Freedom and Whisky

The Outlander Pod Episode 219: Discussion of ‘Outlander’ Episode 305 “Freedom and Whisky”

Ginger: This podcast is in no way affiliated with the Starz production or Diana Gabaldon. All views expressed are solely our own.

(music playing)

[0:16] Ginger Wiseman: Welcome to the Outlander Podcast where the men are kilted,

Summer Reynolds: ...the women are winsome..

Ginger: ...and the whiskey is neat. Welcome to episode 219 of the Outlander Podcast. I’m Ginger

Summer: And I’m Summer, and we are in love with all things Outlander.

[0:33] Ginger: First, we have to hear from you all about 304, “Of Lost Things.” And first up is Amy D.

Amy: Hey Ginger and Summer, it’s Amy D. with some thoughts on episode 4. First of all, I want to say that I am so glad that the show omitted the part where Geneva said, “No! Take it out!” Book readers are all very aware of the circumstances that lead up to that encounter, but I think in terms of the show, those lines would have created a lot of controversy, especially in this day and time. And that would have detracted from the overall story. So I was really happy that they decided just to leave those lines out. Second, I felt like the sex scene between Jamie and Geneva was too graphic, considering that this is yet another instance where Jamie was given no choice. He gave himself to BJR to save Claire, and here he gave himself to Geneva to save Jenny, Ian, and everybody else at Lallybroch. While Geneva was certainly not as twisted and as awful as BJR, she still abused the power that she had over Jamie and she put him in a position of not having a choice about whether or not he went to bed with her. And I’m sorry, but the breast licking was just too much for me and I just thought, “Gross!” I’d much rather have seen the entire sex scene between Jamie and Mary McNab play out in episode 2, since that was an encounter that Jamie actually chose, rather than one that he was manipulated and threatened into. So, I have to question the decision to fade to black on a tender, consensual encounter between two adults searching for a bit of humanity and peace, and to show in graphic detail the entirety of a sexual encounter that was manipulated by threats. I mean, haven’t we seen enough of that already in Wentworth prison? As a reader and a viewer I would have much rather seen the consensual encounter than the forced one. I did really love the interactions between Lord John and Jamie, in particular when Jamie asked him to care for Willie and to act as his father. David Berry played Lord John’s reaction so beautifully, from the stunned expression when Jamie offered himself in exchange for Willie’s care, to the generous, gallant, and gracious way that John refused that offer and allowed Jamie to have both the peace of mind, and also to get to keep his dignity intact. And even though I will forever hate the circumstances surrounding Willie’s conception, getting to see Jamie be a father to his own son, even for such a brief period of time was something really special. We all knew that Jamie would be one heck of a father, and reading about it in Voyager certainly proved that point, but there was a whole other level of appreciation for the deep, paternal instincts that run in Jamie in seeing it portrayed on the screen. And Sam was simply brilliant in every moment with Willie, playing Jamie’s joy and elation at having a son, while simultaneously expressing his heartbreak that he’d never actually get to be Willie’s father. And that final scene as Jamie rode away and Willie chased after him, well I’ll just say it again. They need to just go ahead and hand the 2018 Emmy to Sam Heughan right now. And the best thing about this episode? We are one step closer to the print shop, and apparently we get to see the first bit of Claire’s return to the 18th century next week!

[3:47] Ginger: And, Andrea P.

Andrea: Hi Summer and Ginger! It’s Andrea P. calling from Alberta, Canada. Just wanted to give my feedback here and just want to say that I just love love love season three. It’s getting better and better. Especially love all the addition of all the new characters, uh, Isobel, I just love her. I think she’s fantastic and I like how they fleshed her out more, those key scenes to show us that she just has a really good heart and is really the opposite of her sister, Geneva. And, just as Jamie was riding away at the end, um, heartbreaking, hard scene to watch, especially as a mom. Really hard scene to watch. Um, I just thought it would be a bit at more at peace knowing that Isobel and John will take care of Willie, cause they’re both really good people. Love John! Love him so much! He is just Wesley from The Princess Bride, like I said, and just his expressions and the way he turned down Jamie and his sense of humor. He’s just wonderful to watch. Wonderful to watch. And Bree and Roger, that relationship is growing on me. I didn’t know, but Roger is adorable, those turtlenecks, oh, love it! (chuckling) Those turtlenecks are to die for. I just want to say how much I’m enjoying this season three and you guys’ podcast, okay bye!

[5:13] Ginger: Summer, you have another fan of Isobel. And next up is Ann S.

Ann: Hi, this is Ann S. from Seattle. I just can’t stop gushing about how amazing this episode was, it was so good. I loved it. I was a little surprised that Claire gave up on chasing the ghost of Jamie towards the end. I see how it fits into the theme of the episode, uh, but, you know, after all these years of being so lonely and not being able to talk about uh, what had happened to her and her life, uh, and then the pain of knowing that Jamie had been living in a cave and in a jail for so many years. It must have been really painful, it must have been really hard to give up on that search. So, I’m interested to see how, where that, how that develops. Uh, I felt, you guys were totally right about Jamie’s wigs and the bangs, it kind of bothered me, oops! And then Geneva, her threats didn’t seem as convincing as in the book, but I understand he had to do what he had to do because his family was threatened. My favorite part at, was at the end when Lord John tells Jamie that he’s going to get married and Jamie says, “Married to a woman?!” “Well I don’t think there’s any other option,” (chuckles). Anyway, it was a good, uh, humorous break before the very very sad and sweet ending of the episode. Thanks for a great podcast.

[6:31] Ginger: And, now, Chelse.

Chelse: Hi Ginger and Summer, this is Chelse. I just wanted to say, even without the letters Jamie was sending, Geneva could use the fact that he was still a prisoner and he was still finishing out his sentences. And even with his uh, history of being a Jacobite he still had that, even though his, he had paid his debts, he still had that hanging over his head, so they could easily have just, she could have easily said any little thing and she could have sent him back to uh, prison. So she kinda had that going, holding that over him. Thank you so much! And I look forward to the next episode. Bye.

[7:05] Ginger: And now, Cindy P.

Cindy: Hi, this is Cindy P. from Maryland. The stuff with Jamie in this episode was completely amazing. His relationship with Lord John, his relationship with Willie, his, the stuff with how Geneva, and um, Willie came to be. Not sure if I really liked the way some of the power kind of got taken from the Greys and given more to the Dunsanys, but, eh, I can overlook that. But, I loved how Isobel actually had a personality! Uh, I never seemed to really get that from the books and Willie was so cute. I think my favorite scene this time was the one where Jamie makes his little, “So, if you look after Willie, you can maybe...have me,” and John’s reaction was priceless. And I can’t wait to see more of Lord John. And I hope maybe we’ll get more Isobel too. And I hope ya’ll have a great week. Thank you. Bye.

[8:11] Ginger: Erica B. writes: “Hi Summer and Ginger. I just wanted to say how much I loved the episode. The end had me in tears over the pain Jamie must have been feeling leaving Willie. As a parent it was probably one of the most difficult decisions he ever had to make. I loved how both John and Isobel knew that Willie was Jamie’s son and my favorite line, said by Jamie, was to infant Willie, ‘You are so wee.’ It was just so adorable. Also I have a twelve year old’s brain, like Summer, and wanted to say, ‘Wee wee.’ (laughs) I’m glad they didn’t (laughs), I’m glad they didn’t make the Jamie and Geneva scene rapey, but I do wish they kept in the letter bit, as I didn’t feel as though there was enough pressure for him to go through with Geneva’s request otherwise. I think as a book reader I am predisposed to strongly dislike show Geneva. But I’m not sure non-book readers were given enough to dislike show Geneva the same way. I’m curious to hear if non-readers didn’t like her as much as us readers. Not a fan of Sam’s hair this episode. It doesn’t do him any favors. I did notice a fair amount of dialogue was straight out of the text, or very close, this episode, and that was nice.”

Next up, Eileen P.

Eileen: Hi Ginger and Summer. This is Eileen P. from Melville, NY. Let’s talk a little about arranged marriages. Now arranged marriages were the norm in Jamie’s time period. We saw Mary Hawkins upset about a prospective arranged marriages in season two. She couldn’t marry who she loved. She had no choice, even when she stood up for herself. The only reason he escaped from the marrying prospect number two was because she ran away after the Duke of Sandringham lost his head. Remember, Claire and Jamie were an arranged marriage. Okay, that one worked out. But it’s not like they said, “I love you, let’s get married.” There wasn’t much choice. It was the only way to protect Claire from BJR. Now we have Geneva, betrothed to a wealthy man old enough to be her grandfather. Well, Geneva knows she has no escape from the marriage. She’s doing what’s expected of her. But that doesn’t mean she will tolerate being completely miserable. She didn’t want her first time to be with an old man. What young woman would?! Should she have blackmailed Jamie? No. But it seems her only choice was to pick a servant and she needed to make sure that servant wouldn’t talk and ruin her reputation. She had leverage over Jamie, and she used it. Blackmailing Jamie was wrong. But I understand her dilemma and her motivation. Geneva lost her virginity to Jamie Fraser and had the best first time ever. Admit it, you’re mad at her, but also a wee bit envious. Now about the result of Geneva’s first time. Willie. Ginger pointed out that Willie has theme music. I’m not sure, because there was dialogue above it, but I think the instrument is an oboe, which is a double reed instrument. Bagpipes are also a double reed instrument. I think the selection of an oboe to represent Willie is a nod to his Scottish heritage. Of course, an oboe could just be an oboe, like a rabbit is a rabbit and a white blouse is a white blouse.

[11:24] Ginger: Next up, Jacquie B.

Jacquie: Hi Ginger and Summer! This is Jacquie B. A quick frustration is with the Geneva scene. Her bedchamber. Was not a fan of many of the choices. I know that Voyager kinda tread murky waters as far as consent goes and we had to clear that up on the show, but I feel like Jamie’s choices to uh, go full on birthday suit and let Geneva watch, uh, did not seem uh, necessary to take care of the business at hand. I don’t think he would have done that um, and it further takes away from the fact that Sam just did incredible, incredible, I mean, award winning acting. No lie um, especially with all the scenes with Willie. Toni’s writing was exceptional and I think the moments where her writing shown the most were the parts where she decided not to uh, alter the books. The scene with Lord John Grey, um, the scene with Willie becoming a stinking Papist, they were all beautiful and perfectly ripped from the pages. Thank you all so much for what you do and can’t wait to hear more from you.

[12:29] Ginger: Next up, Jenni C.

Jenni: Hi, this is Jenni. I have a little more of a shoutout than an actual comment. Um, my mom Marie um, got me um, set up with this podcast and she and I always connect over Outlander every week. We live thousands of miles apart so watching the show and then talking about it every week is really important to us. This weekend I’m going to be missing the show because I’m going to Scotland, which is an exciting reason to miss Outlander, but I still wanted to give a shoutout to my mom and let her know that I plan on talking to her about Outlander and all of my adventures as soon as I get back! Love you very much, Mommy and I love that, I love the podcast. Thanks. Bye.

[13:05] Ginger: Now it’s time to hear from Johnny

Johnny: Hi Ginger and Summer, this is Johnny from (unintelligible) Missouri. I found your podcast in the Droughtlander between Seasons 1A and 1B. This is my first time calling but I really like listening to you guys. I liked the way they handled Isobel. I thought it was great they gave her more agency than um, she actually had in the book. And um, actually the way they handled Geneva wasn’t too bad. I liked the fact that they toned it out that she actually had the power in that scene and so this was not a willing thing on Jamie’s part. Um, and the Jamie/Willie stuff just tore me a new one. I was a puddle by the end of the episode. But anyway, I really like you guys and thanks a lot. Buh bye.

[13:43] Ginger: Martina P. writes: “So enjoyed your podcast. I was sobbing along with you, Ginger, while I was deadlifting in the gym. (laughs) It, it seems we get an even stronger episode each week and I loved this episode so much that I am wondering if there is much room for improvement. I always thought I would hate the episodes before their reunion and I find that the opposite is true. I immensely enjoy the focus on Jamie’s story while I hate to say that I am just a little bit bored with the storyline in the 20th century. Could totally sit through a whole episode with cutie Willie, Isobel, Jamie, and Lord John, and we can add Lord Melton to the mix. Just fascinated with the characters. I hope and pray that I will gain more interest in the Roger and Bree story. They are so cute, especially Roger, but not really feeling it. I’m very surprised that I liked every single scene with Lady Geneva. When Jamie and Geneva shared the screen I couldn’t take my eyes off them. And yes, that includes the bedroom scene. I thought it was tastefully done. I hated Geneva in the books, no I loathed her. However, in this episode I see a young, helpless, and scared young woman that compensates with super bitchiness on the surface. I find myself understanding why she wanted to be with Jamie. Who wouldn’t want that experience? There’s one line I had been missing from each episode. ‘Lord, that she may be safe. She and the child.’ I hope we will get it from Jamie at least once. Also, Jamie’s hair was really bad. And if this was a wig I will add it to the long list of bad wigs in this season. A less handsome man would look ridiculous with that hair, especially the bed head after the sex scene. The ending on both storylines with the beautiful Bob Dylan song has me gasping for air and is pure perfection. It breaks my heart when Jamie rides off with utter devastation and despair written all over his face, and then the last look before fade to black. Tear jerker. And Sam Heughan. Holy cow. He is hitting it out of the park, this season especially.

Next up, Lisa T.

Lisa: Greetings, lasses. It’s the intrepid Lisa T. Um, I was just calling to comment on Ep. 304 which I thought was absolutely incredible, um, “Of Things Lost.” It was just absolutely brilliant um, Hannah James just hit it out of the park as Geneva. I think, you know, we just watched a star get born. Um, and Tanya Reynolds was great as Isobel. I’m bummed that we won’t get more of their story. But I, I wanted to comment especially on, so there’s of course the, the scene between Jamie and Geneva and the bedroom and everything and I think that was beautifully done. It was really specific, they didn’t, didn’t try to overcomplicate things so I thought it played really well. I’m, I noticed Summer had said she thought it went on a little bit long and I think, that reminded me a little bit of Wentworth with um, Black Jack, when that went on a little longer, you know, it, it, it is disconcerting. But also the way it was shot, mostly just saw their bodies, um, so it was a lot less intimate. Anyway, so moving on from there to uh, Jamie uh, putting himself up, uh, out there for Lord John. I think that’s a different, I have a different take on that than in the book. I think um, in the book it’s different, but I think Jamie really needed to get that out there just to clear the air with John and it was almost like he had taken a page out of Geneva’s playbook. But I think what really, what cemented that um, that for me was just the way he uh, with, when John had sort of taken his hands in, in um, Ardsmuir and then um, he put his hand on John’s, so it was sort of clearing the air from that scene. And I thought that that was um, that was just a really interesting point. And I loved everything with Willie, it was, I was just in tears. Thanks, lasses! Bye.

[17:24] Ginger: And now, Marlo R.

Marlo: Hey Ginger and Summer, this is Marlo R. And my love for Lord John Grey continues and David Berry is doing an amazing job, I think, showing the complex nature of his character and the relationship with Jamie. Um, he continues to look out for Jamie, much to his brother’s dismay, and in the end he ends up marrying Isobel so that he can continue to take care of Jamie by taking care of Willie. And the conversation where Jamie offers himself to Grey in payment for taking care of Willie has always been one of my favorite parts of the book and now it is in the show as well. And I think it was really handled beautifully. John’s response that he will probably want Jamie for the rest of his life was so touching. And John showed the evident pain of unrequited love and yet he accepts what Jamie can offer him, which is just his friendship. Helwater, though a difficult place for Jamie at times, gave him exactly what he needed to help him in his healing. It gave him Willie. And you could see that at times he was actually almost happy. But the end of the episode was a doozy. Jamie was finally free to go home and he was no longer a prisoner. But from his face you could tell that he was never more empty or sad than he was at this point. At least not since he had sent Claire back through the stones. Willie had given him something to live for. But now he was gone too. Well, that’s what I have. Thanks for everything, guys! Bye.

[18:48] Ginger: Michael M.

Michael: Hey Ginger. Howdy Summer. This is Michael from Shawnee, Kansas. I’d like to begin by saying, in the book I had a strong dislike for Geneva, however on the show my dislike for her was not so much. Two of my favorite moments in this episode did not come from the book. They were Geneva in the mud laughing and looking forward to her next ride with Jamie and Hal’s appearance with the Dunsany sisters while Jamie and Lord John were playing chess. Like a lot of people, I thought that Toni Graphia’s selection of Walk Off the Earth’s cover of Dylan’s “A Hard Rain’s Gonna Fall” was an excellent choice. And now for my final thought. Mi último pensamiento - si el joven William hubiera sabido quién era Jamie, realmente, habríamos oído ... (song playing) “He’d say I’m gonna be like you, dad. You know I’m gonna be like you. And the cat’s in the cradle and the silver spoon.”

[19:50] Ginger: Nadine.

Nadine: Hello ladies, this is Nadine J. from (unintelligible) South Carolina. Episode four, um, was pretty fantastic and I think I’m mostly just gonna say Sam Heughan, Sam Heughan, Sam Heughan was amazing and the writing was so fantastic. And I really loved Hannah James as Geneva. I just love the way they handled so many things in this episode. As a book reader I didn’t mind um, some of the changes they made. The only change I did not like was Jamie giving uh, Willie uh, his, the little wood snake rather than the rosary. Because I think as a book reader those rosaries may show up later, if I remember correctly and I can’t figure out if they follow that line how they’re gonna use the little wooden snake. But, I could be wrong. But um, just love your show, uh, your podcast and appreciate um, all ya’lls comments and um, been following you for a couple of years now, I’d say almost three so um, just wanted to let you know how much I loved the episode’s and the acting and the writing was phenomenal and the Bob Dylan song just kinda finally brought the tears on so, um, I usually don’t cry at these things but that made me cry. Uh, talk to you next time! Bye.

[21:13] Ginger: Virginia H. writes: “Hello Ginger and Summer. This is my first time and I’m not feeling bold enough to leave an audio. The episodes are available to me on Sunday night, Monday dawn. I’m in Brazil. Last night’s episode was all about expressions and words unsaid. First time I’ve ever seen Hannah James on screen and thought her performance was impeccable. The scene where she feigns a horse fall and ends up in the mud was some sort of comic relief. She was naive, immature, spoiled, and dangerous all at the same time. Once again Sam Heughan kills it. Especially where there are no words involved. Such an accomplished performer, those eyes have got a lot to say. And once again, production gets it right, even when small changes and arrangements have got to be made. Jamie and Geneva’s night together was a bit rushed and the writers decided to keep on the safe path, avoiding certain issues raised in the books. I missed the sticky part (Ginger chuckles) and kept remembering your voices from the read along, which made me laugh. I’ve become a loyal follow of your podcast and love your remarks, point of view, and jokes about books and show. To sum up, consider me a fan.

And now, Jenny S.

Jenny: Hi, this is Jenny S. from Salt Lake City, Utah. I have to agree with you guys that Geneva’s threats toward Jamie, they don’t carry as much weight as they do in the books. But I will point out that Geneva’s threat was to tell her mother who Jamie is, which could result in his parole being revoked. Jamie responds that he’ll not go back to prison, which is what prompts Geneva to bring up Lallybroch. And he can’t flee without putting his family at risk. But it did seem like Jamie was a little quick to agree and his waltzing into her room was quite comical. Um, I was surprised, though, that I enjoyed the sex scene between Jamie and Geneva as much as I did. It just seemed like Jamie was tenderly helping her through her first time, just like Claire helped him when he lost his virginity on their wedding night. And, in general, I thought Hannah James did a really good job making me sympathetic to her character and her life just wasn’t her own and she was doing what she could to take control over what she could, and despite the blackmail Jamie was kind to her and she seemed really sad when uh, Jamie explained to her that what they shared wasn’t love. Um, but I loved getting to see Willie, and no, he doesn’t look much like Jamie but he’s beyond cute and there’s a wonderful interaction between the two that makes that moment when Jamie has to leave him behind just so heartbreaking. And the Bob Dylan song was perfect and the whole thing, it just made me cry. Alright, thanks guys.

[23:43] Ginger: Now we hear from Sandi.

Sandi: Hi Ginger and Summer, this is Sandi from Oregon. Um, really quickly just wanted to say how much I love love love the relationship between Jamie and Lord Ja, John Grey. Uh, I think that uh, Jamie having a Redcoat that he can entrust with the, the care of his son, um, that thing with the telling him he has his friendship forever and then Lord John Grey saying, “It means the world,” um, that is just, it, it’s a wonderful thing, um, I really enjoyed that. Geneva, did not enjoy her, I also thought that the sex scene was too long, but Willie came of that and the relationship between Willie and Jamie was wonderful. Every time Willie called Jamie Mac, my heart melted. And the stinking Papist, that was just the sweetest thing ever. Uh, and then when he had to leave him it was just so heartbreaking. And I have to say, the sex scene between Jamie and Geneva was long, just imagine what we might have in store for us when Jamie and Claire get back together. If they’re gonna give us that much with Jamie and Geneva, I have to imagine that we’ll get so so much more when we see Jamie and Claire finally reunite. I’m also looking forward to no more Jackie O. hair on Claire because, let me tell you, not really a fan. That’s my two cents for this week. Talk to you soon. Bye.

[25:00] Ginger: Here is Sara V.

Sara: Hello, this is Sara from Chile, South America. First of all, I want to thank you for including my previous comment. Second, I want to say that I loved this episode. It has been my favorite so far. Um, third, I want to agree, I don’t know who said it, I, I just think that uh, Geneva looks a lot like, like Claire. There was one uh, part when um, I thought uh, Jamie was seeing Claire again. But no, it was Geneva but she looked so much like Claire. So yeah, I agree uh, uh, with whoever said that. Um, another thing it, was that I loved that song at the end, “A Hard Rain’s Gonna Fall.” I liked the version they used very much. Uh, it made me cry. It made me cry, it was so sad to see um, Claire and Brianna leaving uh, us, whereas um, as well as um, Jamie leaving. I mean, yeah, uh, it made me very uh, sad. Although, we know, I know what’s going to happen, uh, also, oh my God. Lord John. I love him so much. So, thank you for, uh, listening to this and I love the pod, podcast. Thank you.

[26:29] Ginger: And last but not least, Shelsy J.

Shelsy: Hey Ginger and Summer, this is Shelsy from Orlando, FL. So I was thinking about Isobel’s comment about, no matter how nice the cage is, it’s still a cage. So I thought it would be interesting to look at some of our characters and the different prisons that they find themselves in and how they deal with them. So Jamie, of course, he is in actual prison. He’s a servant and his other prison is his life without Claire. Uh, he handles them with a sort of grim determination. Um, he has actually chosen all of his prisons and he has done so in order to protect his family. Claire, her prisons were her marriage with Frank, uh, unequal rights for women in her time and, of course, her life without Jamie. She handles it with a sort of bloody determination. She doesn’t try to escape her prisons, but she fights for her rights within them. Geneva, her prison is not having any rights, being an economic pawn, and being forced into an unwanted marriage. She handles it by sabotaging the system from the inside and, unlike Jamie, she does so to the detriment of almost everyone she knows. Lord John’s prisons are his sexuality, societal norms, and English law. He, his approach is to sort of move clandestinely within his prisons and he does his best to find loopholes. William’s prison is actually his status and his title. He doesn’t really know that he’s in a prison, but it still costs him his entire family before he can really even understand why. And finally, I think Bree is in an emotional prison. She grew up in a home where her parents kept their emotions locked up tight and uh, she doesn’t really know how to express them. And, I think she knows she needs to break out of her prison but doesn’t quite know how. Uh, but I think we’ve started to see her chip away at the walls a little bit. So, those are just my thoughts, I’m curious to hear if you guys can think of any other ones. Thanks!

[28:24] Ginger: And now, on to the episode discussion. This week we are discussing episode four, entitled “Freedom and Whisky.”

Summer: (whispering) Episode five

Ginger: Episode five, jesus christ. Episode five.

Summer: (laughing)

Ginger: (singing) Superstar! (laughing)

Summer: Right? Episode five, entitled “Freedom and Whisky.” Also...

Ginger: That’s okay, we, we really liked episode four so we’ll just do it again (laughing)

Summer: Also written by Toni Graphia. She’s written back to back episodes. I don’t think that they’ve done that yet.

Ginger: I don’t, I don’t think I’ve seen that yet.

Summer: In the long history of three, two and a half seasons of Outlander they’ve never had back to back, uh, episodes written by the same author, so, uh, I was looking forward to seeing how hard I was gonna cry. Thanks, Toni.

Ginger: So the title card is of Claire, or Claire’s hands, putting together a Christmas ornament for Bree. 1948, Brianna’s first Christmas. We are in Boston, 1968. We are very graphically reminded that Claire is not only a doctor, she’s a surgeon. Here we see her elbow deep in someone’s bowel, or at least their, their innards. Along with Joe. Love this man. What first caught my attention is how the anesthesiologist is keeping track of the patient’s blood pressure. Oh my goodness. They have a cuff, which is still used today, monitoring the patient. So they’re using a pressure monitor.

[29:52] Summer: I mean, how, I don’t even understand how that works. Do they have to keep tightening it and then like, doing the little test?

Ginger: Oh my gosh, I don’t know, it must be.

Summer: Cause you know how when they do the arm test they have to keep like, pumping it up and then, and then reading it, I mean that, that seems like being um, you said that was the anesthesiologist doing that? If that was the anesthesiologist, that, it’s a way more involved gig than, than it is now.

Ginger: Yeah

Summer: Now they just kind of sit there, I don’t, and they just sit there and like, look at monitors and stuff. The fact that they had to like, constantly be like, pumping up and depressing the arm cuff. I don’t know, I just know, that I, or whatever they had it around.

Ginger: It was her arm, I would not want to be that person, that’s all I know. So the patient has some bleeding, some unexpected bleeding and that’s not good. Claire wants to get to some of this dead tissue first. So apparently there’s this necrosis, this dead tissue, that, that they are removing. But the last bit is still there while the patient springs a leak. Springs a, a bleeder. So before they tie off the bleeder, she wants to get the necrosis. And Joe is arguing that they don’t have time, but she’s set on removing it. So, we’ll return to this later, but interesting, what I will say now about this scene is, not only does it place us, or place Claire as a serious medical professional, as a surgeon, in our mind’s eye, literally in front of us, it’s Joe saying, “We don’t have time, we don’t have time.” So you have this new theme of time and Claire is repairing this, before she can repair the bleeder, make it fully functional, she’s removing the last bit of death, the last bit of dead tissue, before she closes up and this patient can go on to heal. So let’s leave that alone for now. I’ll come back to it.

Then we go to Brianna’s history class at Harvard. This is an interesting choice as well. Book readers will recognize something that the books visit in books five through six, I believe. So I got a lit, I got a few gut, goosebumps here. I gotta tell you Summer, I did not know that Paul Revere wasn’t the one, one who went all the way. (chuckles) I mean, that’s what we grow up with.

[32:03] Summer: Wow. You made that really sexual sounding.

Ginger: Oh, not, I didn’t mean to.

Summer: You didn’t know he was the one that didn’t go all the way.

Ginger: We also get a peek into Brianna’s artistic talent. Did you catch what she was sketching?

Summer: The cloisters

Ginger: Yeah. Where we will visit later. So after the holiday break, well this entire episode is around the Christmas season. After the holiday break the, the professor says, the history class will “continue to examine how fictional prose can alter the perception of history.” Isn’t this funny? Again we get themes of history and perception.

Summer: And this comes back…

Ginger: Oh yeah

Summer: ...like, I feel like this particular teacher and this particular lesson pretty much drove home all of the misgivings that she was already having. I’m like, it was a really ill timed lecture when you think about it.

Ginger: We find out that Brianna is failing history, as well as her other classes. Or at least she’s not doing well in the other classes. Her history teacher brings up the fact that her father was not just a colleague but his friend, so Brianna is well known around campus. That must be awkward. The loss of her father, of course, had to have an impact on her. It is so hard to see all of this in the time frame that we should. All of the ‘60s scenes in DIA, or in season two, happened after Frank died. So, episode 303, when he dies, and now. So that’s hard to place because we’re trying to go forward (chuckles) in this season. They’ve gone to Scotland after Frank’s death. Brianna learned that Frank wasn’t her biological father and that her mother was a time traveler. She witnessed the time travel in front of her, of Gillian Edgars. Now they’re back in Boston and Brianna is understandably having a hard time adjusting. Her world has shifted. The loss of a family member, the gaining of a family member, the finding of that family member, finding out your mom was a (singing) ho, just kidding. We know she fought to get back to Frank. But really, finding out your mom is a time traveler? That’s gotta be weird. (chuckles) It makes sense that this would be affecting her studies overall. But I appreciate that Toni Graphia has given us the reaction of the history teacher, specifically. A very nice Frank tie in.

[34:16] Summer: Well, I think that, you know, for book readers this is the beginning of a major shift in Brianna as a character because like the books she was studying history, like Frank. And then when she found out that her own history was flawed and colored by the people who told it to her um, she began to become um, to not trust it any more. And if it’s something that you can’t believe in or trust it’s not something you’re gonna really excel or want to excel in. So she started to look for more things that I think were more concrete. And things that um, you could explain and you could, you could configure and things like that, and so I think that bringing in the architecture and her looking at kind of seeing how things work and talking about that was a good tie in and, and will be something that I’m, I think is gonna come back.

Ginger: Um, am I the only one who laughed at the line, “You’ve got to turn this around, Brianna. Your future here is in jeopardy.”

Summer: (chuckles) No, but I thought it was, I always think it’s weird when teachers are like, “You can talk to me. You can talk to me.” (chuckles) And I’m like, “I don’t want to, and that, what am I gonna tell you?” And it’s the whole, “Well, you, you were doing so well, even after your dad died and then since you’ve been back I’ve seen your grades plummeting,” and he’s like, “What’s changed?” And I’m like, “You gotta, how much time do you got? This is gonna take awhile. Took my mom, you know, three weeks to tell me in Scotland.”

Ginger: In the next scene she goes home. The music starts and it ends up as Frank’s theme. She looks at her first Christmas ornament, then the clarinet starts. The camera focuses in on what we assume to be his chair, or at least some place he liked to sit. And she sits in it. She opens his pipe box and sniffs it. You could see her forehead crinkling with the emotion she feels. And next she goes to a photograph box. So sad. Her, her and her parents, as a baby, she sees one photograph. Her mom with Frank as she graduated medical school. It’s also very appropriate to be doing this in a dimly lit room. Then she sees a very sweet picture of Frank cuddling baby Bree.

Summer: You thought that was sweet? His like, whole hand was like, splayed and it looked like he was like, shoving her head towards his face! It was weird! That, I think it was his hand that was the creepiest. It was like, it, his whole hand was like splayed out and like, it was weird. It looked like he was trying to palm a basketball and shove it into his mouth.

Ginger: (laughs) I’m not thinking about that when he’s holding the only child he’ll ever have.

Summer: It didn’t, it was an awkward way to hold a baby. Um, and then I wrote, “Ugh, seriously!” But then what I wrote was um, about that scene, I said, “Frank’s chair! And Frank’s theme?” Question mark. Cause I still don’t recognize it (laughs)

Ginger: Are you kidding me? (laughs)

Summer: I just assumed they were gonna go there (laughing)

Ginger: You’re a dork, Summer, I love you. Okay. And then they have a close up on Brianna’s face as she looks at this very special photo. Then we’re taken to the hospital. We are anchored, or connected, by, opening on a picture of Brianna graduating from high school. Claire’s looking at the picture with a concerned look on her face. We see that she’s with Joe. He asks what really happened in Scotland. She says well, there was someone from her past.

[37:46] Summer: I wanna go back, just a second. Because when they were doing surgery in the beginning and I felt like Joe was looking at her like she had become someone different. Like, he looked like she was acting out of character when she was like…

Ginger: That’s a good point, I didn’t catch that

Summer: She’s like, “Give me another second.” “We don’t have another second.” “Well then give me one.” And he just looked at her kind of like, “Who are you?” And it, and to me that was like, I’m like, that always seemed to me like the way she’s treated everything. Like, “I’m right, I’m gonna do what I think is right, ya’ll are gonna figure it out and I, I know what’s best.”

Ginger: Oh

Summer: And, and I don’t know if, if she’s reverted to that or if she’s changed her mannerisms or if this was just like the one special case, but I would think that if they were on a lot of surgeries together this was not the first time that she stepped in and was like, “No, I can do this. I’m gonna fix it.” And you know, was like, “Screw the rest of you, I’m doing what I’m doing.” So I just, I thought that was kind of a strange thing since they seemed to be so close and they, they have a shared office for christ’s sake. They, it seems like this is something they do a lot, work together, so I thought it was odd that he would be, kind of odd, you know what I mean?

Ginger: Surprised

Summer: Or surprised by her actions

Ginger: Well that makes me think, and he, I agree he did have a weird look on his face. If he is surprised in whatever capacity, to whatever extent about her, her actions or her attitude, that makes me think, if, since this is after she comes back from Scotland, if her trip hasn’t, I mean obviously she went through something there, but if she hasn’t changed a little bit after that trip and maybe she’s beginning to revert to her old Claire.

Summer: Maybe

[39:33] Ginger: So I’m glad you picked up on that, I did not. So they’re back in the office and he asked her, “What really happened in Scotland?” And she says well there was someone from her past, but then, “We went our separate ways.” But she says they weren’t able to work it out. I love that Doctor Joe says, “Eff fate.”

Summer: I love that they were both drinking and he was still on the clock

(laughing)

Ginger: Oh yeah, this is the ‘60s. They smoked and drank.

Summer: I would be real upset if I found out that my surgeon was drinking on the clock.

Ginger: Well apparently the doctor who delivered you was

Summer: Eh, it’s never been confirmed

Ginger: Our mom confirmed it

Summer: No, she said he just smelled of alcohol

Ginger: Smelled like alcohol? (laughs) Usually you have to be drinking or spilling it on yourself

Summer: That doesn’t, that doesn’t mean he was drunk. He barely had time to get to the hospital. I’m lucky I wasn’t

[40:19] Ginger: That’s true, you barely came out. You barely waited for him. That’s true. Claire leaves. Joe lets the audience know that their conversation isn’t over. To be continued. And then we have, I forget the song, but we see a picture of Roger arriving in Boston. He’s come to the US. This is a huge change from the book. Can’t wait to hear what book readers think of this.

Summer: Well, it is a huge change. I think, like I said, I, I’ve said in the past that from what I understood they were accelerating the Brianna and Roger timeline. Um, because in the books the man walking on the moon happens after Claire goes back and it’s something that Brianna watches, I believe Roger’s there, Brianna and Roger watch it with Joe and Joe’s family and I believe Brianna fixes the TV because she’s all engineery now. But in the course of all those things happening, so they, it looks to me that while in the books Roger does come to America, they have pushed it to him coming to America to deliver information and spend Christmas with them, as opposed to Ro, um, Claire being gone, Brianna going back to Boston and then Roger coming and visiting her then.

Ginger: And they set it up nicely so that at the end, cause we know, we’ve all watched the episode, when Claire leaves she’s there with someone.

Summer: Correct

Ginger: So I, I get, like I said I didn’t, I don’t remember the name of the song or how it went, but one of the, one of the lines were, “Show me a man that’s got a good woman.” So, that was, that made me laugh. Roger’s so sweet as he preps himself and rings the doorbell, but of course not everything is hunky dory at casa Randall. Brianna answers with a rude, “What?!” And Roger...

Summer: Dude, seriously. I, I have been in many a fight behind a closed door with many a people and I have never ever answered my door in that manner

Ginger: No, that’s just shocking

Summer: Like, I wouldn’t even answer my phone like that. Like if I was having an argument, I’m like, I will pause, I will answer the phone and I will be like, “Hello?” (chuckles) If that had happened to me I wouldn’t have like, slammed my door and been like, “WHAT?!” I would’ve still been like, I would’ve opened the door quietly and not screamed at the person before I saw who it was. And to be honest, I would’ve looked through the peephole first.

Ginger: Well, okay, I’m glad you said that because I was gonna say, I honestly, I don’t open the door. I just don’t do that. Especially if I’m having a fight, you know they’re gonna hear it. No I don’t need to add to that. But yeah, the very least, look through the peephole then you can compose yourself. Cause if she had seen him she’d have been like, “What? Holy crap! Roger’s here, okay. Hi Roger! What are you doing here?” And what does Roger answer with? “Happy Christmas.” So at least he’s kind of a buffer there. If they won’t make up, meaning Claire and Brianna, then at least the fighting mostly stops and then Brianna leaves. Well, okay, immediately Roger says he regrets coming. Brianna is not making eye contact with her mom. And the crux of all of this? Brianna has decided to leave Harvard and move out of her childhood home. She says she needs a break. “You expect me just to come back to Boston and be who I was. I tried and it’s not working.” I think that’s very fair. Finally, finally, finally, and it’s not her fault, but the writers and the storyline are giving Brianna something to play with an emotion. From her looking at her, at the pictures of her father, us seeing her, you know, how, how sad and how destroyed she was by that, and now this fight with her mom. You know, people may find her annoying, a character, in the books people said the same thing, but she, she doesn’t have a, she, she had a, I don’t want to say easy, she had a nice upbringing, but, you know to lose your dad at, in the books it was I think sixteen or seventeen, sixteen and um, well, sixteen or seventeen, just before she graduated high school. Here in the adaptation it’s I think eighteen but, yeah. So um

[44:15] Summer: No, isn’t she twenty?

Ginger: I think she’s eighteen when she loses Frank, her dad.

Summer: Yeah

Ginger: That’s what I mean

Summer: Okay

Ginger: So she is saved by a honk. A friend or, I believe, someone she knows, she’s expecting uh, is outside waiting for her and she leaves. She tells Roger, though, that they’ll hang out the next day. How awkward for him. He offers to go to his hotel but Claire will have none of it. She takes him to one of their rooms. Now Roger hasn’t been back to Inverness yet, we find out, and this is his first Christmas without the Reverend. So it’s been a few years since Frank has died, but just after the Reverend died, correct?

[44:54] Summer: Yes

Ginger: So Roger says he wants to try an American Christmas. “Maybe make some new traditions of my own.” Hmm, is that so? The new tradition we learn of, Claire and Frank would read A Christmas Carol to Bree every year. Claire wants to know exactly why Roger came. Claire makes an important statement. “I’m glad you’re here. Brianna needs someone to talk to and you’re the only one who understands what she went through during the summer.” So he has some news. He says he found Jamie. Claire’s face is shocked and her body language as he moves to sit next to her on the couch and show her the document is stiff. She is not very open at all. Completely different body language from just a moment earlier. Roger reads a line of Robert Burns straight from the document he’s holding. It is one that she’d quoted to Jamie. Roger says he thinks that Jamie wrote that. Again in the opening on the document he quotes the same poem, the author. The problem? Robert Burns was six years old in 1765 when that document was printed. So he believes it had to be Jamie. The author? Well the printer’s name is Alexander Malcolm. So right then the beginning of the love theme plays. You can see the struggle in her face. She has documentary evidence that Jamie was most likely living in Edinburgh in 1765. According to their timeline that was one year ago. Roger, poor, I felt so bad for Roger, Summer (laughs). She rips him a new one (laughs)

Summer: Well, I, I’ve, I’ve, I’ve titled this, you know, the byline of this episode, “Everyone’s shitting on Roger.”

Ginger: Ha

Summer: And also, I am really afraid that Roger is an alcoholic

Ginger: (laughing)

Summer: Because in legitimately almost every scene he’s either brought a bottle with him, suggested whisky, or um, says we need to have a toast. But whisky is literally in every scene he’s in and even in the last episode after she finds him on the, on the roster for Ardsmuir and he’s like, “Never too early for whisky!” (laughs) I think Roger’s an alcoholic.

Ginger: Roger is all smiles. He’s so

Summer: Cause he’s drunk

Ginger: He, he’s so happy. He’s happy for Claire, he’s happy for them, he’s happy for Claire, but Claire can’t allow herself to be hurt again. And she turns on him. It was quite harsh. Poor Roger, he just wants to help. Her line here is interesting. “I could’ve lived the rest of my life not knowing.” Now I thought this could be taken two ways. As in, “I could’ve lived the rest of my life,” meaning forever, “and not have ever found this out.” Or, “I would’ve rather not ever found this out.” (chuckles) She goes on to say, “Twenty years ago I shut the door on the past and it was the hardest thing I’ve ever done. When you told me he survived Culloden I began to hope. I can’t go through that again.” “But Claire, this isn’t hope. This is real. You can go back to Jamie.” And now she must face what she didn’t face, or couldn’t face, or wasn’t ready to face, while they were in Scotland. After they saw Geillis go through the stones at Craigh na Dun and Brianna believed her and said she could or should go back and during their entire hunt for Jamie, I wonder if it was that hope that carried her through, but that she didn’t quite believe it possible for real. If they’d found this proof while they were still there, would she have had the same breakdown there? The only reason she didn’t go back then is because she lost her momentum and didn’t want to continue searching. That was her call. Remember the library? She called it there, she said, “No,” she basically said, “No.” They had a dead end at the library with those ship manifests and Brianna wanted to keep looking and Roger was like, “We’ll go to every port of call.” She’s just like, “No.” That was her call. I think she thought that shiz was getting real. There was real evidence he’d survived Culloden and it was, maybe not a game, but it was a hunt. Finding him in Ardsmuir was one thing. She was into that. She found him, remember lucky number seven? But when they had one rough time at the library homegirl couldn’t do it.

[49:27] Summer: Do you think her not wanting to find further proof was like, at the first sign that she, that they’re not, the, the first roadblock she comes up against, that she immediately is ready to throw in the towel because that way she won’t have to choose between leaving her daughter and going back to Jamie?

Ginger: That’s where I’m going. So one wall put up was enough to send her back, meaning send her back to Boston. Because the next thing they found would, ostensibly, be the voyage he took to the New World and where he lived after that. Claire is the one who put the brakes on that. Roger and Bree, as I said, were happy to continue. Here Roger is visiting her with evidence that Jamie was alive just a year earlier in their time. He did the work for her. I believe she was scared and here comes the reason, perhaps. She says it’s Bree. She says how can she leave her daughter, especially now that Frank is gone? But let’s think. The whole time they’re searching for Jamie for her to go back just maybe? Frank was already gone. Did she have no concern for leaving Bree alone then? I think it’s a convenient excuse for her to throw up when shiz starts to get real. In the library, their first failure, she stops. “I can’t do this.” Roger brings her evidence Jamie is alive. She freaks out and confronts him. “I never asked you to do this!” And throws out the Brianna excuse. I don’t think I buy it, Claire. At the root of all of it, the getting closer and the confirmation, is fear. Understandable human fear. The fear of someone who has shut herself off to love, who has closed down her heart to protect herself. The fear of a surgeon who must be calculating in her incisions. The fear of someone who is twenty years older than she was when she left the love of her life. The fear of someone who bears the marks of childbirth. The fear of someone who years for reuniting with the love of her life but fears that maybe, just maybe, the years will have changed one or both of them so much that he will not accept her, or maybe love her, in just the same way. It’s funny how we don’t get the feeling that she worries that she’ll not accept him (laughs). So that look Claire had on the couch, that body language, is fear. Okay, I’m off my Claire soapbox, mostly. She says, “How can I leave Brianna? I am her mother and she needs me. And I cannot abandon my daughter.” Roger looks so forlorn. He says, “How can I help? What can I do?” Claire answers with…

Summer: She says, “Don’t tell Bree.”

Ginger: Exactly. She says not to tell Brianna and he agrees not to.

[52:08] Summer: She’s just, “Shh, don’t speak, don’t speak.”

Ginger: How’s that? She won’t go back to Jamie because she can’t leave Brianna. Yet something that might actually make her happy, the fact that her bio dad is alive, she wants to keep from her own daughter? Again, it’s not for Bree, or rather it is outwardly. It’s for her. So she can protect herself and live in the reason that she’s not going back because of Bree. Roger excuses himself and blames the jetlag. Dude, I get outta dodge too. (laughs)

Summer: I mean, like I said, everyone’s shitting on Roger.

Ginger: Totally. But he leaves the copies of the document there. Good lad.

Summer: Which she then stows in her purse to carry with her at all times?

Ginger: Seriously

Summer: She’s like, “I’ll just put that in my purse.”

Ginger: The love theme strongly plays as we see Claire in the next scene in her gorgeous yellow nightgown. I wrote, “LOL.” Holding Jamie’s mother’s pearls. Then we go to Joe’s office at the hospital. (singsong) And we get the bones. Remember every word of this scene, dear listener. Every word. A friend of Joe’s brought him a box of bones “for a second opinion.” This friend is a forensic anthropologist named Horace Thompson. Right when Joe starts to pick up the skull from the box music starts. Now I did not have a chance to go back and like, turn it up and listen to the music. Like, a mystery, mysterious music, that kind of thing. Here’s what Joe says about the, the box, the bones. “Pretty lady, full grown. Mature. Maybe late forties.” Claire picks up the skull and says, “He sent you over a hundred and fifty year old murder victim.” Exsqueeze me, what Claire? Joe looks at her quizzically and says she’s only off by about fifty years. When asked what made her think she was murdered Claire says, a little shyly, “I don’t know.” Joe continues, “She’s from a cave in the Caribbean.” And you know I went to (singing) “From a cave in the Caribbean I wish for a war. I knew that I was poor, I knew it was the only way to rise up!” Sorry. And, “there were artifacts.”

[54:24] Summer: You’re not sorry. Don’t pretend you’re sorry. But you should be sorry because that was really strange intonation.

Ginger: It was cause I’m not a rapper (laughs). I’m a singer, not a rapper. I’m a lover not a fighter. Okay, and, “There were artifacts found with her, with the murder victim,” as he lies out the bones of the spinal column. Then he finds the murder victims atlas and axis. These are C1 and C2, the C1 and C2 vertebrae. These are the top two bones that link the cranium to the spinal column. He confirms that Claire was right, this woman had been murdered. Not, she didn’t have a broken neck, though. “Somebody tried to cut this woman’s head clean off.” “With a dull blade,” he adds. And Claire says she just felt like it. And they’re still not done with us. Claire reiterates for us, “Found in a cave, you said?” So they’re keeping this, they’re keeping you, they want you to remember this, dear listener. Joe says, “They believe it was a secret burial,” and he says that this woman was not black. Her tibia was shorter in proportion to her femur and Claire nods in understanding and says, “Ah, the crural index.” So they are reiterating that this woman was murdered. It was two hundred and fifty years ago, in a cave, at a supposed slave burial site and she was not black. He says, “Bones don’t lie.”

Summer: It’s the crural, crural index. C-R-U-R-A-L index is the ratio of the length of the lower leg, leg in the strict sense, in which, the sense it is used in this paper, to that of the thigh. Crural.

Ginger: And then Joe changes the subject. “Why aren’t you telling me about your man in Scotland?” She sits and admits that the dude in Scotland was Bree’s real father.

Summer: And I would like to say that Joe was way more shocked about her saying it was a murder victim (Ginger laughs) and talking about bones than he was about Brianna’s parentage. Can we talk about that?

Ginger: I don’t think that he was shocked that Frank wasn’t her bio dad. Because he did, she looks nothing like, well Claire, frankly, but she looks nothing like Frank.

[56:43] Summer: Well for sure, but it, you should at least give someone the dignity of pretending to be shocked.

Ginger: Oh (laughs).

Summer: You know what I mean?

Ginger: Yeah.

Summer: Do them the, do them the service of that

Ginger: As soon as Joe asks her, “You still love him?” the love theme starts. She looks up and says, “I never stopped.” Joe says, “I watched you live a half life for fifteen years.” I love the inclusion of half life, that chemical term, always bringing it back to science, yo. He urges her to take a second chance at love if she has one. Brianna, he says, will come around. Now, actually, she may already have. It’s Claire who needs to come around, as I discussed earlier.

The next scene we see a TV blaring an episode of Dark Shadows.

Summer: Hmm

Ginger: The conversation on the TV is about a woman’s desperation for uniting with the one she loved, even at the risk of her life. “Yes, Barnabus, she wanted to be with him that much.” So so much of a theme, I mean, my goodness, this is so, yeah. Bree and Roger and they’re watching. So Bree apologizes for the scene the day before and he says that he came for an American Christmas which includes lobster rolls and Boston creme pies. She asks him to accompany her to this thing they’re having for her father at Harvard, naming a fellowship after him. And then they can go walk around

[58:11] Summer: But they did all the walking around first

Ginger: Exactly

Summer: That was strange

Ginger: Exactly. And then we’re at Harvard and now we’re looking at the cloisters that Bree, as Summer said, was sketching earlier. More wonderful what-ifs of the 18th century and later from Roger about, thinking about the history of a place, its bones, what it meant to other people. This, all with Bree. The history teacher talking to Bree’s class about the 18th century.

Summer: Yeah, and then he has his whole conversation and he’s like, cause she’s dismissing the history of things and he was like, “Oh, and you the daughter of a historian,” and she’s just like, very loudly proclaims that she is not the daughter of a historian but the daughter of an 18th century Highlander, I was like, “Cause that’s not awkward.” That’s not something people are gonna overhear and be like, “Oh, that’s just Brianna. She’s a little cuckoo.”

Ginger: As they’re walking around she says she always thinks how things worked, how things work, how they’re built. And this is important too, dear listener. She gets all dreamy, “Each stone is held in place by the pressure of the one next to it.” So if, like Claire, you leave all of the stones that support you, you fall apart. Same with Jamie I, I guess. Claire’s worried that this will also happen to Bree. She’s already lost one stone and if Claire goes back to Jamie, she’s afraid she’ll lose the rest of her support system. Brianna loves things that are based on measurements, calculation, and precision. She says, “There’s a truth to this building.” And Roger, uh, also did not know his real father. The Reverend told him about his father, what he was like as a child. One story about how he built, his father built a birdhouse for martens and that the entrance was too big and a cuckoo got in. He made his father real to him

[1:00:01] Summer: I totally thought, this was one of several lines that I totally thought were gonna go in a different direction, because when he talked about the cuckoo, cuckoo birds, if I’m not mistaken, are known for laying eggs in other birds’ nests

Ginger: Oh, oh. That’s a good point

Summer: I’m leaving, I might be wrong, but that’s what I thought. And I thought that it was gonna be a story about a bird raising another bird’s egg, or baby. It was not. Um, and then there was a whole other conversation after that where, um, where Brianna’s talking to Claire that went a totally different way than I thought it was. Like, it, it took a 180, a hard 180 turn in the middle that caught me off guard, but I’ll get into that later when we get there.

Ginger: So he says that the Reverend helped make his father real to him. Knowing his father helped him know himself. He says, “Everybody needs a history.” “So how do you know it’s true?” Brianna asks him. Here we are back to the word true. Her foundation has been swept out from beneath her. She feels more than ever the need for something that is provable, factual. That is her true. Roger says, “Does it matter?” She believes history is a story and that it changes depending on who is telling it. And of course she’s right. It does, the saying of “the victors write the history.” Right?

Summer: History is told by the winners, yeah

Ginger: Yeah, exactly. So she is actually not wrong, but also think about her own history. So she grew up with her parents telling her something, or her believing something, and then once her dad died, not even right away, two years after her dad died she hears an entirely different story. So it does depend on who is telling you and, I guess, the circumstances, and when, and when and why. So I get that she is very untrusting right now.

Then we’re at the ceremony to uh, commemorate the memorial fellowship in Frank’s name. And there is a plaque there. It reads, “The Frank W. Randall Fellowship, established 1868.” So, Summer, nerd that I am, I thought, they already said where we were, you could already tell, they told us where we were. But then the camera spent like, one, between like two and four seconds, maybe two or three seconds on that plaque. There was a lot of writing on that plaque. Did you happen to read it?

[1:02:36] Summer: Did you read it all? Ginger: Nope. Didn’t think so. So, I paused and I did my best and I believe this is what it says. “Professor Frank Wolverton Randall 1906-1966,” I believe that’s what it says. “Came to Harvard in 1948 and served the history department for eighteen years until his death in 1966. During that time, Professor Randall’s seminal research in the field of European studies, in particular, his work charting the rise and fall of the European dynasties in the early modern period, cemented his position as a leading historian on both sides of the Atlantic.” Now, that might just be an easter egg or it might just be a really good description, but I thought it was a bone. A huge bone. And that’s all I’m gonna say about that.

Summer: Hehe, bone.

Ginger: But you, do you know where I was talking about?

Summer: No, you distracted me by using the word bone.

Ginger: Okay. I’ll quote part I was talking about. “During that time, Professor Randall’s seminal research in the field of European studies, in particular, his work charting the rise and fall of the European dynasties in the early modern period, cemented his position as a leading…” blah blah blah blah blah.

Summer: Blah blah blah blah blah? Yeah, that definitely is worth noting.

Ginger: You didn’t get what I was trying to throw your way?

Summer: You said seminal and I

Ginger: And you lost it. Okay, never mind. (Summer laughing) So that’s lost on Summer. Okay. Claire meets Candy/Sandy and the latter has words for her. We’re reminded her name is Sandy Travers. Claire here is in all black as I think is, I mean, she can wear what she wants, but I thought that was a nice, that it was appropriate. It seems that the two women have very different ideas about Frank. Candy/Sandy says that Frank said that the work is the reward, so that she’s implying that Frank would not have like, would not have liked the little get-together in his honor. And I think that’s fair because Claire’s indignant, and I do get it, I do get it. But she’s the, the mistress. I do understand that, that attitude. However, you also, we also have to be critical of Claire here, that Claire, by her, by the very nature of the mis, having a mistress in front of her, is going to be hyper critical and hyper protective and hyper insult, all of that stuff, right? She’s gonna think of course she knew Frank better, “Of course I knew this, you know, you did not know him.” Well, Claire, no, you gotta step off here, because Claire was together with Frank very little before they were separated during the war. They got together, they were together, heh, less than a week, maybe? Maybe a little bit more than a week? They started their second honeymoon and then she disappears. She comes back and yes, she’s with him for twenty years. But the majority of that time they’re not doing it, they’re not close, they’re not really talking, they’re talk, they’re, they do what they need to do to raise their daughter, and they do a wonderful job in that. I’m not, I don’t think either of them, I don’t think Brianna lacked for care or love. But as far as their own relationship? I would probably say that Candy/Sandy, she, she owns this conversation.

[1:05:37] Summer: No, I don’t think she does, because I think that she has a, another skewed version of Claire and Frank’s relationship.

Ginger: I agree

Summer: She didn’t make him stay. She tried to make him go. He wouldn’t go. And she doesn’t see that because all she sees is her version of the events that passed. She doesn’t know what went on in the household. She only knows what Frank told her, and I’m sure Frank wasn’t telling her everything.

Ginger: I agree. I agree that she has a skewed version of, of that like, her saying that she forced him to stay in a loveless, all that stuff, that? No, throw that out the window. What I’m talking about is her insights into what he liked or what he wanted, right? So the, we know they wanted to get married because he said that. But, just the little things, the first thing she says is that, “Frank wouldn’t have liked this. He said the work was a reward.” I don’t, I think she knew, she may not have known, she didn’t not know the details of their marriage, I, no, not at all. But I think she knew Frank as a person much better than Claire. By that point.

Summer: She definitely saw more movies than Claire.

Ginger: No kidding. She ruined those movies, huh? For her

Summer: She saw all of them. Claire didn’t get to go to any movies.

Ginger: We see a different side of Frank through Candy/Sandy. As she says, “He was the love of my life.” And Frank’s theme plays.

Summer: Ugh, vomit.

Ginger: I do belie...what?

Summer: I said, “Ick, vomit.”

Ginger: I really do feel for Frank, so I hope we get that (singing) book, Diana.

[1:07:17] Summer: I don’t want it if it’s gonna be full of Candy/Sandy

Ginger: I don’t think that, come on, that was for the show. They’re not gonna put Candy/Sandy inside the book. No. I mean, yeah, no. So was Claire selfish? She made Frank and Brianna live a lie? Huh. Candy/Sandy makes her point but she doesn’t know the entire picture, of course, we, and we know that. Bree sees this scene and later asks her mom about it. She says she recognizes Candy/Sandy. She saw her at a bookstore once when she was with her dad. She says that he looked at her the way he used to look at her mom. Bree calls it.

Summer: Awkward

Ginger: Exactly. Bree calls her mom out. She’s like, “Look, we had a chat back at the stones, we agreed from now, from now on truth only.” All I could see was that Brianna’s wearing a wig.

Summer: Ginger

Ginger: They have a heart to heart and Claire admits that she absolutely does think about Jamie. Just as she pulls the photocopy of the document Roger had brought with him, proof that Jamie was still possibly alive, the love theme plays. And there’s even more of the love theme as Brianna says, “Then you can go back.”

Summer: Alright, look. This, this section is the next section where it took a, a hard left when I thought it was gonna go right. When they were talking about Frank and everything and she says, you know, “You say that I look a lot like him,” and my expectation because they were just coming off of talking about her father having an affair, and my expectation was that Brianna was gonna say something like, “That must have been really hard for him.” You know, it must have been really hard for Frank or making some sort of a, an allowance for the things that Frank did while he was married to Claire, um, and then she took this hard left turn and was like, “He must have hated me!” And I was like, “Wow! Way to make that all about you!” I was like, that’s not where I thought that was going at all. Like it stopped me in my tracks, I was like, “What? Wow. Oh, oh, okay. I was not expecting that to be about you.” (whiny) “He must have hated me.” I was like, “Wow.” She is clearly an eighteen year old girl.

Ginger: Ha! Claire tells Brianna that, “No, no no, my life is here with you, Bree.” And Bree sets her straight. “I’m all grown up, mama. I can live on my own.”

[1:10:00] Summer: Can we talk about that? “I’m all grown up,” followed by, “Mama.”

Ginger: Oh, yeah

Summer: I was like, that’s a juxtaposition of, “I’m all grown up, but I still call you mama.” And then, you didn’t even mention this, when she was like, “And it must have been hard for you coming back here, you left Jamie,” and she was like, “Yeah, I was sad that I had to leave him and I, you know, I resented that, but then the first time I saw you,” this was another conversation that took a hard right turn.

Ginger: Or a hard left.

Summer: “I nursed you and I never felt like that before.”

(laughing)

Summer: “The first time, and when I nursed you for the first time.” I was like, “Wow, um.” Look, I say a lot of things to my daughter. She’s not eighteen. She’s nine. However, I, there are many things, like, she says, “Do you love me, mama?” And I was like, “Of course I love you.” And I may say, you know, “From the second I held you, from the first time I look at you, at no time have I ever said to my daughter, ‘The first time I put my boob in your mouth I loved you so unconditionally.’”

(laughing)

Summer: I just thought that was such a strange and weird line. I guess my relationship with my daughter is not as close to the relationship that Claire has with Brianna.

Ginger: Apparently not as special.

Summer: Nope. Not as boob heavy.

Ginger: And the next scene we get them watching the landing on the moon. Just like from the book, but as Summer said, in the fact that they’re watching it is from the book but the circumstances around which that viewing happens are, are different.

[1:11:28] Summer: Now did you notice that Claire and Joe were the only people with grownup cups and everyone else had paper cups?

Ginger: No, that’s funny.

Summer: Yeah, they were like, “We’re drinking like, the grownup like, nice glass glasses,” and everyone else has like these white paper cups. We know who the second class citizens are in this scene.

Ginger: So Claire, you hear a voice over here and uh, one of the lines that was really pretty was, “How many people can say that they,” well, this is not verbatim, this is me adding to what she said, but she is, of course, thinking about her time travel to Jamie and she says, “How many people can say that they’ve even had one trip to the moon?” And by the moon she means a trip to a very special place, a very unique and rare place. Once everything is over people uh, people are still kind of milling around. Claire is the one who turns the TV off and I wondered if there was any significance to that, just like something to give her something to do, or what. But when she’s having this internal monologue of, “This special dance and I only, I got to go once, I don’t know if I can return,” blah blah blah, the dance of the druids theme comes up as she’s looking out at the moon. And then she drinks. But I’m not sure, I, I’m thinking it was whisky, but who knows? Did you notice the dance of the druids theme?

Summer: That one’s unmistakable.

Ginger: It is unmistakable cause yeah, it like, it, not in your face like, awful, but it’s like so, it’s like it, it has the choir, it has the people singing, you can’t really miss that, yeah.

Summer: “The people.” It has Raya singing. Her voice layered over and over and over and over again. (laughs) It’s one person singing.

Ginger: All the Rayas

Summer: A choir of Rayas

Ginger: Bree and Claire and whether or not she’ll go. This is a new scene. Claire says she may not ever be able to come back. They may never see each other again. And I thought this scene was done really well, and it was sad. I’ve been trying to figure out, Brianna says something that is really, really sweet. I like this line. “I was trying to figure out if I was more Randall or Fraser. I realized I was more you than I am either of my fathers.” And then Claire says, “I am the one who knows you better than anyone.” Now, because we may not get it, in the books, Claire leaves a beautiful letter for Bree. A goodbye letter. It is heartbreaking. I, I forbid anyone, I, not forbid. I challenge anyone to read it who has read the books, not just the letter by itself and, and not have a tear. Now I think, Summer, that this is their letter scene. This is the

Summer: It must be.

Ginger: It has to be

Summer: I’m glad they left out the end of it

Ginger: I know, I know. Uh.

Summer: Nothing ruins a heartfelt moment more than telling your daughter not to get fat

Ginger: Yep. And I think, yeah, so this is their goodbye, rather than through, or her final goodbye, rather than through her letter. And there’s something else. She says what if Jamie’s forgotten her? “What if he doesn’t love me any more?” This, we’re getting to, now, finally, her true fear. Brianna says, “You gave up Jamie for me. Now I have to give him back to you.”

[1:14:32] Summer: That was an awkward line for me

Ginger: It was awkward. So let, let me work through it, because I had two thoughts about it. I think the line should be, because I’m the writer, as, as you all know. “Now I have to give you back to him.”

Summer: Right

Ginger: Now, I wonder if this truly is the line, if it is a mistake on Sophie’s part which I, I doubt. Because they would have, hopefully caught it.

Summer: No, I think that the, the way that they wrote it was, what? He gave, how did it start?

Ginger: “You gave Jamie up for me, now I have to give him back to you.”

Summer: Right, so she’s saying, “You gave him up, and now you get him back.” I think that’s what she’s, the crux is, she’s trying to make Jamie the thing that was taken away and he’s what needs to be given back. However in actuality, Jamie gave Claire up...

Ginger: Mm hmm

Summer: ...for, to, to save Brianna and now Brianna is going to give Claire back to Jamie. Or, however, but the, it, I understood where they were going, cause it worked contextually, but as a line it was kind of strange.

Ginger: So yeah, it didn’t, it didn’t make sense to me on the surface, I had to kind of think about it and when I wrote it out I could kind of, I, I could see the levels of it, um, I think she means this, or the writers mean this, in the sense of, “You’re being pregnant with me took him away from you, now I have to give you back to him,” which is kind of what you said.

Summer: Yeah

Ginger: So recall to the surgery, this is what I was talking about earlier. Claire coming back to herself, getting ready to reunite with Jamie, must remove the last bit of necrotized, necrosis, flesh within herself. She has become dead, save for Brianna. Her heart, part of her that loved, that, and connected to Jamie is dead or was dead. As she gets closer to their reunion she becomes more and more, opens up, becomes back to life, more and more. She removes this last bit of dead flesh, in other words, becomes completely alive, as she prepares to meet for Jamie, who is her home. Loads and loads and loads more love theme here. Claire is also waking up from her sexual suppression. She wants to hear about how she looks. She’s opening herself up to things more. She’s still afraid because otherwise she wouldn’t be asking these questions, but

Summer: Are you jumping to the Joe scene now?

Ginger: Sorry, yeah, we’re with Joe

[1:16:59] Summer: Okay, can we talk about that for a hot second?

Ginger: Yes

Summer: So she starts the whole thing with, “Am I attractive?” Which was an awkward statement to begin with between friends, right? That’s not something you normally say to your friends. And then he kinda looks at her like, you know, “Give me an out here,” you know, make this less awkward, and then she says, “Sexually,” and doubles down. And I was like, “Okay, you just,” (laughs). I’m like, the first thing is something you probably never should ask your male friend and then you double down with, “Sexually,” (chuckles) just kind of, instead of like, having a statement that followed it to take, to make, give it more levity, it just kind of got more awkward.

Ginger: So his reply is, “You’re a skinny white broad with too much hair and a great ass.” They left out the boob part, which I think is fine. But, so there we go. She has confirmation of her looks from someone she trusts and she will miss Joe. Remember this, how we leave Joe and her, or at least what’s shown to us. Is this the last time they’re literally together before she hops outta dodge, get, leaves dodge, gets out of dodge, or leaves town, whatever. Skips town? Is this all she tells Joe? Just think about that a little bit

Summer: She had to, I don’t know how much time it took her to make that dress

Ginger: Oh gosh

Summer: With the underscoring of Batman. Um.

Ginger: Yeah

Summer: Which, that was a, what, a diversion

Ginger: Odd

Summer: It was, it was very strange. Claire has always been good at sewing people up, but...

Ginger: People. (laughs)

Summer: ...dressmaking is not in her skill set, though apparently in this show it is. Um, and that clearly would have taken her some time, and then she also had to draft her resignation letter and go to the bank and put all the stuff in her name and put the deed in Bree’s name, so she was very busy so I don’t, I think this was probably the last time. And, and you could tell by the way she said, “Thank you,” that, her thank you was a goodbye.

Ginger: Uh, perhaps. Perhaps. We don’t know

Summer: It was loaded. That was a loaded “Thank you.”

Ginger: We’ll, we’ll get there. I, cause I have some, I have something, I have a question about that. So it is Christmas and the three of them…

Summer: But only for Claire. She’s the only one who gets presents.

Ginger: No it’s, well, when, when they’re all together, yes

Summer: She’s the only one who got presents

Ginger: When they’re all together, yes. When she leaves, the others get presents. Or as, at least, uh, Bree does. Oh, and then Bree gives Roger something, so they do something

Summer: Right, but here’s the question. This is also something that’s gonna jump around with the timing, which means did she make that dress overnight? Or did they all give her presents a week before Christmas?

Ginger: Well we don’t know exactly when she went back, like on the day, was it Christmas day, was it after Christmas? Cause if they did…

Summer: No, I know, but, but Brianna didn’t open her present from Roger until after mom left. And then she gave Roger her present after Claire left which means that sometime between when Claire opened all of her Christmas presents and she, she and then Brianna and Roger opened their Christmas presents from each other, she made a dress.

Ginger: So even if it was, well not only made a dress, she left.

Summer: Yeah, so I don’t know if that means she made a dress overnight? Or a dress in a day? Or I, I have, it had to have been at least a day. Cause she also finished the dress, dyed her hair, and filled her pockets.

Ginger: Yeah, and she had to do all the house and the bank, all that stuff, and, although, wait, that, part of that could have, no that was done, no, because she did that before she, she handed the stuff over to Bree just before she left, right?

Summer: Correct.

Ginger: Okay, so, that stuff was done before she left, which is after the making of the dress, so I think it’s safe to say that either one of two things happened. They either did Christmas on Christmas and they did the, the remaining presents after she left, whenever that was, or they did Claire Christmas a, early, whatever, and, and then did theirs on, on the day. Now something else that we’re not, we’re not bringing up and, cause they’re not really, they kinda, they kind of pay it lip service. The only time, it has been mentioned, it has been mentioned. But when Claire goes back, it’s on Halloween so that would, that has some significance, right? So that is a fire feast, that’s where the, the portals are open whatever. Sorry, when she goes the first time. When she comes back that was like a forced, that was April so it wasn’t really, it was a half a month, so about fifteen days before a fire feast, before Beltane. So that was, I mean, close, I don’t know if that’s close enough. Who knows? Whatever, but she went through. Now that she’s doing it and she can plan it, right? There’s, she, there, there’s no rush, I mean other than, “I want to get back.” So that’s completely like, glossed over. Completely. And whether or not Brianna and Roger actually exchanged gifts on the day or even after the 25th, which doesn’t really matter, but I’m thinking it was on the 25th because not only, I, I get that it was, I get that it was part of an older tradition, but the, the two or three reasons, two reasons that I think that their, their little thing was on the 25th is that she prepared something for him, right? She made that little lobster roll thing, so that was on, I think that was on Christmas because he wanted to do a Christmas tradition. I’m just thinking that’s a little bit of evidence and the fact that he gave her a book that he had found out that they had read to her on Christmas. So to me those two, and that she read it. So that was like a continuation or re-beginning of an old tradition with someone new. So I think if either happened on Christmas, I think you’re right. I think it happened on those.

[1:23:13] Summer: I’m just confused about the timing of the last twenty minutes of the episode

Ginger: Now you had me thinking hard and I didn’t want to do this, but. So at this first Christmas, the Claire Christmas, whenever that may be. They got Claire some coins for her trip and Roger also got her a book about Scotland. Claire “borrows” scalpels and penicillin. Now, I’m glad they did this, but I think it’s something that we could have waited for because, dear listener, if they had not announced it now, you would have heard, you would have heard about it, fret not, you would have heard about it. But they let us know that she was going back prepared which, okay. It’s, not a loss but, it’s, it is what it is. Bree got her a necklace with a topaz in it, on her bos, her birthstone. Um, she reminds us, or the writers remind us that Claire needs something to burn up as she goes through the stones. Now here we get a little more, see this is how they put it up, they, they are educating us, or at least reminding us about TT, time travel. She, Claire, and Claire talks about it like, “Oh yeah, cause you guys didn’t know this!” She’s like, “Oh yeah, that’s right!” She’s educating us, or reminding us that the first trip through it was her jeweled watch and then the second trip through it was the stone in Jamie’s father’s ring. So she says she’s gonna make her dress. I’m not sure quite how believable this is but it’s done. All, as Summer said, all to the theme of Batman. And Roger, uh, Brianna calls it, Roger’s a TV nerd.

Summer: I found it disappointing

Ginger: About Roger?

Summer: No, the Batman theme.

Ginger: Oh. (chuckles)

Summer: I mean, it was like, it was kitsch. I just think there’s so much more exciting things that Bear has written that would have been less (groans), cause that’s kind of how I felt when it went I was like, (groaning) “Okay.” And then they keep bringing it up! It comes up again like, first he says, you know you make your own Batman utility belt, then they play the Batman music, and then they call it the Batman suit all over again. And I was just like seriously rolling my eyes.

Ginger: She, after she makes the outfit, she, we, we see her in front of the mirror and she looks at her face and skin with a very pretty love theme playing under her, and we see well the gray streaks in her hair. And uh, the next day when she’s prepping to literally walk out of their lives forever they call attention to her hair. She’s dyed her hair. And she tells them all about the secret pockets she made and that it was made out of raincoats

Summer: And can we talk about her coloring her hair?

Ginger: Yeah

Summer: I don’t think she thought that through.

Ginger: No, because it’s just gonna come back, exactly

Summer: She’s not gonna be able to color it again and it’s gonna come back and it’s not gonna look natural any more because it won’t be just a full strand of gray down it’s gonna be a chunk of gray, like a brick of gray that’s gonna grow out and have a, like a definite line everywhere that the gray is. It’s not gonna be cute. She didn’t think it through. Either that or she’s gonna have to find a, a hair stylist, a Lady Clairol in the 1700s.

Ginger: Or just some really dark henna

Summer: As a, as a person with gray hair, once you start dyeing it, you cannot stop. The only option to get it back to gray, or to whatever its natural state is, is to cut it off (laughing) and shave it and start over, and I don’t think she’s going to do that.

Ginger: Oh no, she’s known for her hair

Summer: So either they’re just going to conveniently forget that she ever had gray hair or it’s gonna be a, a really awful grow out period for authenticity.

Ginger: Claire also wants to borrow Brianna’s blouse

Summer: Can we, can we talk about borrow?

Ginger: I thought, I thought...huh?

Summer: Is she planning on giving it back?

Ginger: Yeah, exactly, borrow? Yeah, exactly. Roger goes off to get something and uh, while he’s gone Claire gives Brianna her resignation letter. Or is it? And the reason I say that like that is because, as I said earlier, I don’t know that when she said, “Goodbye, I’ll miss you,” or whatever she said to Joe as she left his office, I don’t know that that was their final conversation. Because, when she leaves him in that room, she hasn’t mentioned anything about stuff, right? She’s just mentioned Scotland and the dude she’s gonna go try and hook up with is Brianna’s father. So that’s all

Summer: It could be a combo. She did write him a letter in the book I believe, and I think there was a combo, it could be a combo. Could be a, “Here’s a resignation letter in this envelope and also, hey Joe, this note’s for you.”

Ginger: That’s why I said, “Or is it?” Because, this is what she says. She says, “Here’s my resignation letter,” and she hesitates. She says, “Um.” Now is there a reason for that? And then she follows it up with, “He’ll know what to do with it.” So I think there’s more than mat, here’s, I think it certainly does have her resignation letter in it, but I think there’s much more to that letter than she’s telling Brianna. That’s all. And as Summer said, she says, uh, gives her the deed to the house which is now in her name and tells her that all the bank accounts are also in her name. So imagine, not just Claire’s bank accounts but whatever she got from Frank when he died, so homegirl’s like set up for awhile now.

Summer: Yep.

Ginger: You see, this is the problem adapting Diana Gabaldon’s books. If you don’t, then that’s sad. But you should be thinking like, five books or more ahead. Especially right now before she goes back. Because this will affect many things later on. Maybe. In another huge change from the book, Brianna isn’t going to Scotland to accompany her mom through the stones, but she wants to do it. Claire does on her own terms. The first time, she says, she was terrified. The second time heartbroken. This time she wants control over it. She wants it to be peaceful, which I completely understand. I get that. And here the love theme starts again. Brianna says, “Find my father. Give him this,” and kisses her mom.

[1:29:21] Summer: And, and in another change from the book, it wasn’t a creepy mouth kiss

Ginger: Oh. Yeah.

Summer: Which was, in the book I was kinda like, “Ehhh?” cause she kissed her full on the mouth. Now, there was no tongue involved. But it was a mouth kiss. A very definite mouth kiss in the book and I always thought that was kind of strange, and how odd it would have been for him to receive it later when she plants one on him and said, “This one’s from your daughter,” (chuckling) and plants a mouth kiss on him, so, I was like, “Ehhh.” So I, I approve of that adaptation.

Ginger: And we’re still not done with the gifts. Oh my gosh, the gifts. She gives Bree Ellen’s pearls. She tells her that Jamie gave him, gave them to her on their wedding night and, “You can wear them on your wedding day, if you like.” And then Roger wants her to be drunk before she leaves.

Summer: Seriously, alcoholic.

Ginger: They toast to freedom and whisky. And then she leaves. I’ve decided that they always choose Toni when it’s time for someone to leave or lose a child. I mean, come on. It was a gorgeous love, gorgeous love theme here. So Bree makes Roger’s dream come true for an American Christmas. Lobster rolls, Boston creme pie, and more gifts.

Summer: But, I need to know, how long were those lobster rolls sitting out on the counter?

Ginger: Oh my gosh

Summer: I’m so concerned. If there’s anything that I hate, I talked about it earlier, spoiled food. And second, spoiled milk, me tracking the spoiled milk in a scene is second only to improperly stored shellfish. And I don’t know how long that lobster roll was sitting out on the counter and it concerned me. That might have been a very long goodbye.

Ginger: The final gift we see, I think, I think, is Roger giving Brianna a copy of A Christmas Carol.

Summer: Now I, we all love Jamie, for sure. He is the best book husband, however, Roger is clearly the best book boyfriend. Like, he’s so endearing, and giving her that present and just his look, the look on his face while she’s opening it and then I, ah, he’s just, he’s got the whole book boyfriend, he’s got the boyfriend thing down.

Ginger: He definitely, he was, he was watching her.

Summer: So good

Ginger: He was so into her. So he gives her a copy of A Christmas Carol and they look wonderfully into each other’s eyes and they kiss. I love how this scene closes as she begins, “Marley was dead to begin with. There was no doubt whatever about that.”

Summer: And Roger took his first step towards food poisoning by eating a bite of lobster roll. Oh gosh.

Ginger: Of the lobster roll. I love the transition from the taxi to the puddle in Edinburgh.

[1:32:10] Summer: Now the puddle lines, they were from, wasn’t that the Prologue?

Ginger: I believe so

Summer: That was like the very beginning of the book, I believe it was in the Prologue and I love the lines, we had a big long discussion about them

Ginger: Mm hmm

Summer: And I’m glad they were able to keep that in some way and work them in, it was perfect and I, and I agree with you, I completely love the puddle segue into the 1700s.

Ginger: It startled me. I went, “What?! There’s no stones?” Sorry, my cats just both woke up. Sorry babies.

Summer: I’m kinda glad they didn’t. What are they gonna do? They don’t ever show them going through the stones and it just seems like a waste of time to watch her arrive in Edin, arrive at the airport, find a car, load a car, drive the car up to the Craigh na Dun, walk up the hill...

Ginger: Well, they’re not gonna show that

Summer: ...touch the stones, I’m like, we, they don’t need to see it. And then we don’t need to see the travel and the day just cut to the chase where we all want to be, it’s printshop.

Ginger: So, as I said, this is a huge change from the book but it’s beautiful, and they kept the lines about the puddle. Okay, when she steps out in the blue dress into the puddle, I love this so much. Summer, I lost my (bike horn honking). I can’t take it. I can’t take it. Not just, oh, first of all you see it’s the shoe and the blue dress, right? You’re like, “(gasp!) This is her, this is, she’s dressed up, so we can’t be, oh my gosh, yes, we’re, we’re, we’re in Edinburgh.” So like, it happens that fast and then (singing), I think that was the music right there, so the druid theme, I think. It’s the Claire, I wrote, “It’s the Claire we know and love. The no makeup Claire,” or at least the

Summer: So much prettier in the 1700s.

Ginger: Oh, are you kidding me? Are you kidding me?

Summer: Her hair up and the no cat eye Barbara Streisand ‘60s makeup. I’m just, I just think she’s so much more becoming in the 1700s.

Ginger: Well, not only do I agree with you but also, this is, this is how we fell in love with Claire visually. This, Claire, we were not introduced to in the ‘60s. Even Claire of the ‘40s was not, I mean, obviously, it was a different time period, but even Claire of the ‘40s was not heavy makeup Claire. So, and I know that was a trend, I’m not, I’m not, you know, dowt, downing or dissing anybody in the makeup department. They did their job. Really well. But man, I think the most difference and the most dramatic change besides her clothing is her freaking face! She just, it looks, the, when the camera comes up and you see her face with she’s scared and she’s excited and all of this stuff it, it just, I mean it takes you straight back to Dragonfly, or I should say season two, when she leaves him. It takes you straight back, she looks, even though it’s twenty years later, for all intents and purposes, it is our Claire. It is the same Claire, different Claire, I know, but it, just the look is so reminiscent, it shocks you. I was more shocked in a happy way, that made me happier than anything, Summer. Seeing her face was the most dramatic of, I think thus far in all the episodes with her, of, of season three, that was the most dramatic reveal, the most dramatic look of anyone, is just see, and the reason why it was so dramatic was it was so natural and so simple. And it’s the Claire we love who was with Jamie. Ah. So. I wrote, “No makeup, Claire. It’s the Jamie and Claire Claire. Oh my gosh, that music. The sights and sounds of the city. So wonderful.” She starts walking and she asks a young, he, another Gavroche, uh, for Alexander Malcolm. And the young boy says, “He’s in Carfax Close.” Oh my gosh. When you hear that, it’s like, ooooh, tingles, tingles, tingles. She enters the Close and she sees the sign. For a moment her hand goes to her stomach in, in, either in disbelief or in nerves or just, you know, in, in, in anxiety, whatever, but she’s, she’s smiling, she’s radiant. That’s what that, that, that’s the word, Summer. She is freaking radiant like this. She gets close to it and she touches the sign and smiles. And finally climbs the stairs to the printshop. She gets to the door. She enters slowly and the door bell rings and we get a crap ton of their love theme. The light is automatically more golden when she enters. It’s much warmer, much more reminiscent of Jamie who is, in the books at least, mentioned as uh, symbolically as the sun, over and over again. So this is very much Jamie in the warm light. And then we hear Jamie’s voice, “Is that you, Geordie?” She approaches, I guess you call it the landing? It’s whatever the, the second story where she’s on. She approaches the little balcony area and seeing him down there with her up there, a rever, even though she’s higher, as the character is, isn’t it like a reverse Romeo and Juliet?

Summer: Heh

Ginger: Where Juliet, the one who’s higher is looking down and trying to contact, or get a hold of, or get the attention of Romeo? Isn’t that great? And she says the words we, oh, oof, we, the words, and she says, “It isn’t Geordie. It’s me. Claire.” You can see the tension in his body immediately. He slowly turns, looks up at her, steadies himself on a pile of printed paper, and then faints

Summer: Which is a terrible place to try to steady yourself

Ginger: Exactly. And the episode ends with a very shocked looking Claire who is a little freaked out that her love of her life who she has just found again is lying unconscious (laughs)

Summer: Well, he, he’s twenty years older, she doesn’t know if he has a bad heart. She could have just killed him.

Ginger: That’s true. (laughs)

Summer: And now we wait for two weeks. This is the worst ever

Ginger: Okay, Summer.

Summer: Well that, ya’ll, that was uh, episode 305, “Freedom and Whisky.” Join us, not next week, but next time

Ginger: (laughs) Not next time. Uber next time

Summer: But, uh, for the next episode discussion we have, which will be in two weeks, uh, will be about episode 306, entitled “A. Malcolm.” Is it “A. Malcolm, Printer” or just “A. Malcolm”?

Ginger: I, I think, I think it’s “A. Malcolm,” but I could be wrong.

Summer: Me, let me see, I think I texted it to you at one point. “A. Malcolm,” just A. Malcolm.

Ginger: So thank you, as always, so much for listening. We look forward to our next episode.

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Transcribed 10/14/17 by Shelsy Joseph